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[Kinan]

I think they made a comeback, personally, last year. If it weren't for the ds and psp, S-E would be...well, boring. But due to their ds output I think they're clearly above their ps2 level already. Not quite at their snes or psx level though, of course.



Even the cities are boring.

I liked Rabanastre. If only not the fucking zone loading every 30s. :/

 

[HK-47]

I think they made a comeback, personally, last year. If it weren't for the ds and psp, S-E would be...well, boring. But due to their ds output I think they're clearly above their ps2 level already. Not quite at their snes or psx level though, of course.

Yes, wonderful remakes and spinoffs, just to get that argument out of the way.

The best thing Square has done this gen is get Tactics a proper translation. Of course they shoved lag into the game, but its a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

 

[HK-47]

I think they made a comeback, personally, last year. If it weren't for the ds and psp, S-E would be...well, boring. But due to their ds output I think they're clearly above their ps2 level already. Not quite at their snes or psx level though, of course.



Even the cities are boring.

Rabanastre is the most alive I've ever seen a city in an FF.

 

[Kinan]

Since Vanille is wearing one, we can assume they're mages. They look like high tech white mage robes to me, personally. White mage robes in FF are pretty iconic to me, and that's the first thing I thought when I saw them.

Remember that only...L'cie or whatever the fuck can use magic in FFXIII. iirc Vanille is one.

Hmm, is this means everyone who can use magic is a criminal in Cocoon and caught and sent to Pulse?

 

[Aeana]

If you turned on the "wait" mode in an ATB system where all of the action pauses once one of your characters' ATB fills up, does that essentially turn it into a turn-based system?

Not really. Especially since time still passes when you're at the menu, unless you open up a submenu (spells or items).

I can't imagine it's ever fixed, at least not any game that has a speed attribute on characters. The difference between a real-time combat system and a turn-based combat system is that in the real-time combat system, the system will act without waiting for the player.

That being said, with what we see in FFXIII, it seems entirely real-time. Not only is the order of actions determined in real-time, but also the results are affected. You can interrupt attacks and your attacks can be interrupted. The positioning of the models on screen effects the timing, which effects the chaining, etc. It uses an ATB system, but the pacing seems to be very similar to FFXII's pacing. I would have to imagine that the party members would be controlled by AI based on menu settings or something, it already seems hectic enough to control one character at a time at that pace. This does definitely seem more like FFXII's battle system than X or X-2's to me, I think the fact that battles are not seamless is what throws people off here. Familiarity with WKC's battle system probably makes it easier to bridge that gap. This game looks like it took WKC's system, which had great ideas but relatively mediocre execution, and perfected it.

Have you played FF10-2? Everything I bolded applies to FF10-2, as well. FF13's combat is very easily an evolution of FF10-2's combat.

 

[HK-47]

I liked Rabanastre. If only not the fucking zone loading every 30s. :/

What did you expect? The amount of detail was way bigger than X and that had the same kind of zone load problem in Luca

 

[Rpgmonkey]

Square Enix's the same as always to me.

Some of their newer IPs are "eh", some of them are surprise hits, and their bigger games are pretty decent or great.

As for the turn-based issue, I've always considered ATB to be an active system that's not exactly a real-time or turn-based system, but something inbetween the two. But then again I've never felt ATB exactly fit what I've always thought of as a real-time battle system or a turn-based system, so I've always considered it something else.

 

[darkwings]

What did you expect? The amount of detail was way bigger than X and that had the same kind of zone load problem in Luca

I was positively surprised by the loadstimes in FFXII. Compared to many other PS2 games, they were fluid. (Tales of the Abyss anyone?)

 

[Aeana]

Really? I thought they were terrible.

I remember Suikoden V came out the same time FFXII did in Japan. People railed on Suikoden V's load times while FFXII's were probably as bad.

FF12's loading times were kind of bad on my old PS2, but on my new one they are really quick.

Also, I think Suikoden 5's load times appear worse than they are because you see "now loading" at the end of every battle.

 

[StuBurns]

FFXIIs loading itself isn't so bad, but at some points of the game you're hitting loading screens all the fucking time, it did get annoying.

 

[Unknown One]

Square Enix's the same as always to me.

Some of their newer IPs are "eh", some of them are surprise hits, and their bigger games are pretty decent or great.

As for the turn-based issue, I've always considered ATB to be an active system that's not exactly a real-time or turn-based system, but something inbetween the two. But then again I've never felt ATB exactly fit what I've always thought of as a real-time battle system or a turn-based system, so I've always considered it something else.

I agree.

If it was real time they would probably have no turns and just dynamic battle with the monster constantly moving and attack with a pause. While you're staying still picking your attack.

Might as well turn it into an action rpg if you are going to make it a real time battle system.

This is more of an evolution to the previous games. While it's still turn base, it's more dynamic.

 

[Kinan]

What did you expect? The amount of detail was way bigger than X and that had the same kind of zone load problem in Luca

Yea, I know that it was limitation of hardware, and they even built a lot of stuff around that "zoned" design, but it still was annoying as hell, especially in the city.

Was happy to see almost no loading in the FF13 demo, hopefully full game will be also like that.

 

[Hobbun]

That being said, with what we see in FFXIII, it seems entirely real-time. Not only is the order of actions determined in real-time, but also the results are affected. You can interrupt attacks and your attacks can be interrupted. The positioning of the models on screen effects the timing, which effects the chaining, etc. It uses an ATB system, but the pacing seems to be very similar to FFXII's pacing. I would have to imagine that the party members would be controlled by AI based on menu settings or something, it already seems hectic enough to control one character at a time at that pace. This does definitely seem more like FFXII's battle system than X or X-2's to me, I think the fact that battles are not seamless is what throws people off here. Familiarity with WKC's battle system probably makes it easier to bridge that gap. This game looks like it took WKC's system, which had great ideas but relatively mediocre execution, and perfected it.

Fuck. That's exactly what I was afraid of. I don't want another real-time feel to combat. It's why I hated XII. If I want real time combat, I'll play Versus.

When I heard this was an evolution of FFX, I got excited as it has been my favorite FF combat system. It goes by speed for order of attacks but is yet completely turn-based. It's not hectic and you aren't rushed.

Well, looking at my latest shipping estimates, I should be getting it today. So I will be able to try it for myself. But it doesn't sound good.

 

[Aeana]

Fuck. That's exactly what I was afraid of. I don't want another real-time feel to combat. It's why I hated XII. If I want real time combat, I'll play Versus.

When I heard this was an evolution of FFX, I got excited as it has been my favorite FF combat system. It goes by speed for order of attacks but is yet completely turn-based. It's not hectic and you aren't rushed.

Well, looking at my latest shipping estimates, I should be getting it today. So I will be able to try it for myself. But it doesn't sound good.

It's an evolution of 10-2... it always has been. The developers are completely retarded for calling it an evolution of 10, since 10 doesn't even use ATB. If you liked 10-2's combat, you'll be fine... but it's really nothing like 12.

 

[StuBurns]

I still haven't played it, but from the videos, it's the evolution of the X-2 system I was hoping for, and expecting. It looks a lot more X-2 than XII.

 

[glaurung]

Have you played FFX-2?

I liked FFX-2 enough to buy it again a few months ago on eBay.

Easily one of the most engaging battle systems since FFVII and the game really discouraged grinding. I am still not sure whether I liked that or not, but it kept the player on his toes.

 

[dark10x]

I'm so glad that Hamauzu was given the chance to compose for this game. The music is just so damn good. There really haven't been many Japanese games released this entire generation with music that impressed me, unfortunately, but FFXIII seems like it will most definitely do it.

 

[HK-47]

Have you played FFX-2?

People keep saying it's an evolution over X, but it's not. It's an evolution on X-2 from all the media we have seen.

Oh but wait, no one played X-2. I shall personally hand a noose to every person who hasn't.

Yeah if only the story and characters werent written by retards. They also have yet to reintroduce the nonlinear mission structure.

Hey anyone remember that lightning tower minigame in the Thunder Plains? Yeah, that really sucked. Its like how can we make something worse than lightning dodging?

 

[Hobbun]

Have you played FFX-2?

People keep saying it's an evolution over X, but it's not. It's an evolution on X-2 from all the media we have seen.

Oh but wait, no one played X-2. I shall personally hand a noose to every person who hasn't.

(To Aeana as well) No, I haven't played X-2.

So it's hard for me to make the comparison. Himu, I guess I'll have to take a noose.

Thing is I like controlling everyone, I am glad SE has said we will have that option. But I don't want to be rushed in doing so. It's why I liked X. With prior ATB systems, they weren't so fast where it was real time. You input your command, but still had time to wait for the ATBs to fill and actually watch the action, as well.

And when Awntawn says it feels rushed, it's hard enough to control one character in XIII and that you will probably need AI to do the others (even though I know it isn't set up that way) it concerns me.

 

[StuBurns]

X-2 is awesome if you turn it up fast (it's already pretty quick), it really feels like a constant pressure, very cool.

I can see why people might not like that obviously, but for me, X-2 was by a long way the best battle system in any FF.

The HUD/UI was disgusting though, don't know what they were thinking.

 

[HK-47]

Too bad you could waste everything with a double alchemist dark knight team. Alchemists were godlike.

 

[Hobbun]

Yesssss.

I really like how you have to stay on your toes. I remember fighting Baralai the first time and I couldn't fucking beat him because he was SO FAST so I made my entire party nothing but thieves. I find it appealing how FFX-2 is semi-real time but still a menu driven rpg.

I guess I am the oddball then. The reason I like turn-based combat is the pause in action. Where I get attacked. Then when my turn comes up, choose my action and watch it play out. Yes, you can use the wait option, but it doesn't really mesh with XIII's fast moving combat. Oh, the enemy jumps high and freezes in midair while you are inputting your command. I would rather truly take turns.

*sigh* I guess I am just too old school.

 

[LiK]

*sigh* I guess I am just too old school.

nothing wrong with that. sometimes i just wanna sit back and enjoy RPGs, not stress out over the battles. hopefully they give us an option between real-time and turn-based.

 

[Aeana]

I guess I am the oddball then. The reason I like turn-based combat is the pause in action. Where I get attacked. Then when my turn comes up, choose my action and watch it play out. Yes, you can use the wait option, but it doesn't really mesh with XIII's fast moving combat. Oh, the enemy jumps high and freezes in midair while you are inputting your command. I would rather truly take turns.

*sigh* I guess I am just too old school.

That's why, even though I love FF10-2's combat and I think I'll like FF13's, I still prefer the way it was done in Grandia. It has the good stuff (attack cancellation/interruption, etc.) with a nice pause when your turn is up.

 

[darkwings]

Really? I thought they were terrible.
.

I had a new PS2, maybe it was it.

 

[HK-47]

FFX-2 had the best berserkers. Ever.

Since the game is so X-2ish I'm hoping it has a new game plus like X-2 as well!

The Berserkers made them even more ridiculous looking.

I remember Lady Luck being ridiculously good as well. I guess it was because of the chaining dice and the reels

 

[HK-47]

That's why, even though I love FF10-2's combat and I think I'll like FF13's, I still prefer the way it was done in Grandia. It has the good stuff (attack cancellation/interruption, etc.) with a nice pause when your turn is up.

All good strategy comes when I can take a bathroom break in the middle of battle without pausing.

 

[rager]

It's clear that nobody black has worked on this game. I mean, a fro with a bird (okay, chocobo) living in it?

..


Seriously though they should get Chris Tucker to voice Sazh.

I am black, I like his character design (even the chocofo). What I don't like so far is his personality. He seems more like the stereotypical (scared negro, comic relief character). I has hoping he would be more like a Billie D/David Palmer type black man.

 

[Hobbun]

nothing wrong with that. sometimes i just wanna sit back and enjoy RPGs, not stress out over the battles. hopefully they give us an option between real-time and turn-based.

Yes, that would be nice. Although I can't see how they could do that with XIII with how fast it's battles are set up.

That's why, even though I love FF10-2's combat and I think I'll like FF13's, I still prefer the way it was done in Grandia. It has the good stuff (attack cancellation/interruption, etc.) with a nice pause when your turn is up.

Oh yeah, Grandia is a great game. I loved it's combat system as well. But it's easier to freeze and unfreeze combat with 2d based sprites. When the games go 3d and especially more realistic looking with fast moving combat (like with XIII), it looks awkward.

What I would like is a big budget game that uses turn-based combat.

 

[Aeana]

Oh yeah, Grandia is a great game. I loved it's combat system as well. But it's easier to freeze and unfreeze combat with 2d based sprites. When the games go 3d and especially more realistic looking with fast moving combat (like with XIII), it looks awkward.

What I would like is a big budget game that uses turn-based combat.

It worked fine in both Grandia 2 and 3, which are both fully 3D.

And it sounds like you need a 360 so you can play Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey. Maybe you'll get TLR on PS3 yet.

 

[StuBurns]

The clearly no black person worked on the game thing was probably a joke about N'Gai and RE5. I don't think he was being literal.

 

[LiK]

I am black, I like his character design (even the chocofo). What I don't like so far is his personality. He seems more like the stereotypical (scared negro, comic relief character). I has hoping he would be more like a Billie D/David Palmer type black man.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/73/David_Palmer.jpg/200px-David_Palmer.jpg[/QUOTE]

there's gotta be more than one black guy in the game. there might be a david palmer-type somewhere in the world. ;)

 

[Hobbun]

It worked fine in both Grandia 2 and 3, which are both fully 3D.

And it sounds like you need a 360 so you can play Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey. Maybe you'll get TLR on PS3 yet.

But even with Grandia 2 and 3, you still had 'the line' of party members and enemies. With XIII, you have people all over the place, party members and enemies alike. It's also much more quicker. So you think using the 'Wait' option in XIII wouldn't be awkward? With all the running, aerial flips, etc? Freeze action, input command, resume action. I think it would look more awkward because of just how more realistic XIII is. But who knows, maybe I will be wrong. I don't think they have the Wait option in the demo, do they?

Yes, I've always wanted to play Lost Odyssey, that's exactly what I would like. But I really don't have the space for a 360. And there aren't all that many games I do want for it.

As for TLR, it would be nice if it made it to the PS3, but I am not counting on it. Not after that question to SE in a recent interview about the game. "And when do you think TLR will hit the PS3?" Brief silence."Uh, it just came out on the PC." It's like they forgot about it for the PS3.

 

[LiK]

Yes, I've always wanted to play Lost Odyssey, that's exactly what I would like. But I really don't have the space for a 360. And there aren't all that many games I do want for it.

LO is just pure old school awesomeness~ i love it. if you ever get a 360, put that as #1 on your to-buy list.

 

[Hobbun]

I am black, I like his character design (even the chocofo). What I don't like so far is his personality. He seems more like the stereotypical (scared negro, comic relief character). I has hoping he would be more like a Billie D/David Palmer type black man.

David Palmer was awesome. Still my second favorite character of the show (next to Jack Bauer, of course).

 

[Aeana]

But even with Grandia 2 and 3, you still had 'the line' of party members and enemies. With XIII, you have people all over the place, party members and enemies alike. It's also much more quicker. So you think using the 'Wait' option in XIII wouldn't be awkward? With all the running, aerial flips, etc? Freeze action, input command, resume action. I think it would look more awkward because of just how more realistic XIII is. But who knows, maybe I will be wrong. I don't think they have the Wait option in the demo, do they?

Huh? You move all over the battlefield in the Grandia games, and positioning matters for special attacks. And Grandia 3 added aerial attacks... when someone's turn comes up, the enemies just freeze wherever they were -- even if they were up in the air. It doesn't really look that awkward.

 

[VegaShinra]

Awesome. After being switched in delivery dates for several days and then sitting in Alaska for hrs, the demo has made it and left to the local processing plant and will be at my house today. Woot woot. Good weekend coming up.

 

[polyh3dron]

Yay my Play-Asia order shipped and I pre-ordered on the 11th

 

[Hobbun]

Huh? You move all over the battlefield in the Grandia games, and positioning matters for special attacks. And Grandia 3 added aerial attacks... when someone's turn comes up, the enemies just freeze wherever they were -- even if they were up in the air. It doesn't really look that awkward.

Didn't really want to get into an argument about it. I was just saying with how more realistic FF XIII looks and that it appears to be faster than the Grandia games (2 and 3) it would look more awkward. But maybe you are right. But I guess I won't find out until I see the Wait option in action in FF XIII (if it is even available).

 

[Dali]

I am black, I like his character design (even the chocofo). What I don't like so far is his personality. He seems more like the stereotypical (scared negro, comic relief character). I has hoping he would be more like a Billie D/David Palmer type black man.

I think the design is lame and the personality is weak. I'm no FF aficionado, but isn't this like only the second Black person of any relevance (or at all, lol) in a main FF? I guess you can say Wakka too, because he's like Samoan, and Samoan's like Black, right? Anyway what a shitty follow-up to Barrett.

 

[lunlunqq]

mine is shipped, too!!!!!!! Fuck Yeah!!!!!!

 

[StuBurns]

Raijin was kind of important in FF8.

 

[Shadow780]

There are no better thing than waking up for this~

See you all in 3 hours, : DDDDD

Spoiler

fapping included

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Raijin was kind of important in FF8.

and he was the normal one out of the pair :lol

well i've played the demo, it's as awesome as i expected, really in terms of demos, nothing comes close to this.

I've watched ACC too, it's great, fuck the haters.

 

[LiK]

I've watched ACC too, it's great, fuck the haters.

finally, somebody watched it :lol

 

[Dali]

Raijin was kind of important in FF8.

He's Black?

Oh God, not the race discussion again. He comes the "Raijin is black!" club!

So he isn't Black, then?

 

[polyh3dron]

Holy shit Agito looks awesome, it's like Crisis Core but with a full party.

Fuck yes.

 

[LiK]

Sazh is just goofy, doesnt matter whether he's black or white. c'mon guys, there's probably more than one black guy in the final game. let's not discuss the whole race thing again -_-;;;

 

[StuBurns]

He's not black? He looks it.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

finally, somebody watched it :lol

the ending was much more satisfying this time around, and i like the reference back to the end of Crisis Core too

for those who are like 'lulz the story' it clears up a lot of the vague elements, and makes it blatantly obvious that the story follows FFVII very closely, only in different circumstances

I like how they added a handful of extra tracks from the game as well - and how they added some new scenes for both the Turks and the other party members (though i did hope for some more for them) They've fleshed out Denzel as a character as well, his On The Way to a Smile anime short links directly with some scenes from ACC which i thought was nice.